alan-g-w
Member
Registered: 9th Nov 07
Location: Glasgow
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Hello, I've got a Gerber Clutch pocket tool. It's similair to a Leatherman in that it folds out into a set of pliers. It has a knife on it that is no shorter than 1.5" and no longer than 2". Top tool in this pic, knife is the length of the whole thing:
I got a belter of an LED torch with it in a set and that's on my keys. I've found myself out doing things and thought it would be dead handy to have the plier tool on my keys as well - does anyone have a definite answer to whether this is legal or not? Obviously I wouldn't be taking it to the dancing etc but I'm sure I've read something somewhere that as long as it's under 3" you're OK, for the likes of tradesmen with Stanleys. I've had my car searched before, they found a Stanley and they told me it's fine to have since it was to do with work. But a fold out knife on your keys in Glasgow is a bit different.
Anyone got any solid info?
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dean101287
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Registered: 22nd Jul 07
Location: Cardiff
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I know if your found with any tool in the front of your car its illegal. All tools have to be in the boot. I wouldn't be carrying any knife around with me.
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Teddy
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Registered: 19th Jul 04
Location: Northampton Drives: VW Bora 1.9TDi pd130
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Section 1 of the old prevention of crime act 1953 helps with this.
The defination states
"Any person who without lawful authority or reasonable excuse, the proof whereof shall lie on him in public place any offensive weapon shall be guilty of an offence"
Alan - is a a "lock knife", does it lock out? If so then it is an offence to carry it, under the offence of offensive weapon (as above!) Regardless of length.
If its under 3" and doesn't lock out, then its not an offence.
However, there is a defence, that being if you "needed" it,
For example a carpet fitter on his way to a job, would be a defence in law as this is reasonable.
Or in the case of Gerbers, perhaps a mountain climber?
If you fancy some bedtime reading.........
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/l_to_o/offensive_weapons_knives_bladed_and_pointed_articles/
Hope this helps buddy 
[Edited on 15-12-2010 by Teddy]
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Jamie Walby
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Registered: 15th Nov 04
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by dean101287
I know if your found with any tool in the front of your car its illegal. All tools have to be in the boot. I wouldn't be carrying any knife around with me.
I have a fuck off steering lock in my car for 'defence'
Hi Teddy 
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dean101287
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Registered: 22nd Jul 07
Location: Cardiff
User status: Offline
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My mate has his torque wrench on his back-seat iirc an the copper said that it was an offence and had to be kept in the boot so he couldn't reach it to use it as a weapon.
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RichR
Premium Member
Registered: 17th Oct 01
Location: Waterhouses, Staffordshire
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quote:
Originally posted by Teddy
Section 1 of the old prevention of crime act 1953 helps with this.
The defination states
"Any person who without lawful authority or reasonable excuse, the proof whereof shall lie on him in public place any offensive weapon shall be guilty of an offence"
Alan - is a a "lock knife", does it lock out? If so then it is an offence to carry it, under the offence of offensive weapon (as above!) Regardless of length.
If its under 3" and doesn't lock out, then its not an offence.
However, there is a defence, that being if you "needed" it,
For example a carpet fitter on his way to a job, would be a defence in law as this is reasonable.
Or in the case of Gerbers, perhaps a mountain climber?
If you fancy some bedtime reading.........
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/l_to_o/offensive_weapons_knives_bladed_and_pointed_articles/
Hope this helps buddy
[Edited on 15-12-2010 by Teddy]
I carry a significant knife in my boat kit alongside a Gerber tool essentially for safety reasons, cutting lines etc in the event of a capsize; the knife will cut steel cable; they're permenantly in my coastal gear pocket which is normally in the car as I never know as and when I'll be sent offshore; its in a pocket in a set of offshore skins in a watertight bag - Could I have an issue if I was puleld/searched?
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Tomnova16
Premium Member
Registered: 21st Jan 06
Location: Gerrards Cross Drives: Porsche 911
User status: Offline
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if you're white its ok, if you're black its not 
http://www.lemass.co.uk/ for all your automotive/bodyshop needs
Located in Chalfont st Peter
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RichR
Premium Member
Registered: 17th Oct 01
Location: Waterhouses, Staffordshire
User status: Offline
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cool beans!
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Teddy
Member
Registered: 19th Jul 04
Location: Northampton Drives: VW Bora 1.9TDi pd130
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by dean101287
My mate has his torque wrench on his back-seat iirc an the copper said that it was an offence and had to be kept in the boot so he couldn't reach it to use it as a weapon.
Yep that's true.
Section 1(4) provides a definition of an offensive weapon:-
'Offensive weapon' means any article made or adapted for use for causing injury to the person, or intended by the person having it worth him for such use by him (or some other person).
Hence weapons become offensive in two ways-
(a) Some weapons are offensive per se because they have been purpose of causing injury or have been so adapted
(b) Any article which has the potential of causing injury is offensive if the possessor has it with the intention of causing injury
Its any item MADE or ADAPTED.
Or as per B, a wrench would have the POTENTIAL, but its perfectly reasonable to have it in the car, for this INTENT must be proven, I.E having the wrench down the side of the drivers seat.
In the boot is reasonable, as you may need it to change the wheel and its not accessable from the cabin.
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Teddy
Member
Registered: 19th Jul 04
Location: Northampton Drives: VW Bora 1.9TDi pd130
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by LiVe LeE
quote:
Originally posted by Teddy
Section 1 of the old prevention of crime act 1953 helps with this.
The defination states
"Any person who without lawful authority or reasonable excuse, the proof whereof shall lie on him in public place any offensive weapon shall be guilty of an offence"
Alan - is a a "lock knife", does it lock out? If so then it is an offence to carry it, under the offence of offensive weapon (as above!) Regardless of length.
If its under 3" and doesn't lock out, then its not an offence.
However, there is a defence, that being if you "needed" it,
For example a carpet fitter on his way to a job, would be a defence in law as this is reasonable.
Or in the case of Gerbers, perhaps a mountain climber?
If you fancy some bedtime reading.........
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/l_to_o/offensive_weapons_knives_bladed_and_pointed_articles/
Hope this helps buddy
[Edited on 15-12-2010 by Teddy]
I carry a significant knife in my boat kit alongside a Gerber tool essentially for safety reasons, cutting lines etc in the event of a capsize; the knife will cut steel cable; they're permenantly in my coastal gear pocket which is normally in the car as I never know as and when I'll be sent offshore; its in a pocket in a set of offshore skins in a watertight bag - Could I have an issue if I was puleld/searched?
Possibly, but if you disclose that, that is what it is there for you may be given words of advise not to carry it.
Can only take each situation on its own merits.
If you were just happening to wear that coat at 3am in the morning walking through the park, you might have a big issue!
My advise would be, only carry it when you are boating.
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John
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Registered: 30th Jun 03
User status: Offline
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I've got a leatherman in the car, along with my maglite, both within reach of the drivers seat.
The only one I'd consider using as a weapon would be the torch if I really had to.
I'd like to see either of them being an offensive weapon standing up in court.
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Teddy
Member
Registered: 19th Jul 04
Location: Northampton Drives: VW Bora 1.9TDi pd130
User status: Offline
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Well indeed, it would be down to a jury, if the CPS went with the charge in the first place.
Reasonable person test would apply.
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Edd
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Registered: 8th Nov 04
Location: Glasgow
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by John
I've got a leatherman in the car, along with my maglite, both within reach of the drivers seat.
The only one I'd consider using as a weapon would be the torch if I really had to.
I'd like to see either of them being an offensive weapon standing up in court.
i have a big fuck off maglite in my car aswell
used to have a lockback also but i decided when i got out my car and chased a wee ned who smacked it with a traffic cone that it was time to wise up and put it back with the fishing gear
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alan-g-w
Member
Registered: 9th Nov 07
Location: Glasgow
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Teddy
Section 1 of the old prevention of crime act 1953 helps with this.
The defination states
"Any person who without lawful authority or reasonable excuse, the proof whereof shall lie on him in public place any offensive weapon shall be guilty of an offence"
Alan - is a a "lock knife", does it lock out? If so then it is an offence to carry it, under the offence of offensive weapon (as above!) Regardless of length.
If its under 3" and doesn't lock out, then its not an offence.
However, there is a defence, that being if you "needed" it,
For example a carpet fitter on his way to a job, would be a defence in law as this is reasonable.
Or in the case of Gerbers, perhaps a mountain climber?
If you fancy some bedtime reading.........
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/l_to_o/offensive_weapons_knives_bladed_and_pointed_articles/
Hope this helps buddy
Ideal, just the answer I was looking for. It's not a lock back just a fold out the same as the Victronix Swiss Army knives.
Cheers mate, I'll probably not do it just to save any hassle but was just wondering about the legality of it.
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Teddy
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Registered: 19th Jul 04
Location: Northampton Drives: VW Bora 1.9TDi pd130
User status: Offline
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Ah if its not lock out, then no problems (under offensive weapon)
Dont fall foul of Bladed or Sharply pointed article though 
[Edited on 15-12-2010 by Teddy]
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Mertin
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Registered: 12th Oct 05
Location: Scotland
User status: Offline
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Iv wondered this too as my dads a farmer and always got a knife on him and usually hes in his work clothes till he goes to bed so always in his pocket when he nips to the shop etc and wondered how cops would take it if for some reason he was searched. Iv seen him in the jeep too just empty his pockets (money, phone, knife) into the pocket on the dash.
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harrisp
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Registered: 15th Dec 07
Location: Derbyshire
User status: Offline
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quote:
Originally posted by Mertin
Iv wondered this too as my dads a farmer and always got a knife on him and usually hes in his work clothes till he goes to bed so always in his pocket when he nips to the shop etc and wondered how cops would take it if for some reason he was searched. Iv seen him in the jeep too just empty his pockets (money, phone, knife) into the pocket on the dash.
Most farmers have their shotgun with them 24/7 so a knife is the least of anyones worries
[Edited on 15-12-2010 by harrisp]
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Gary
Premium Member
Registered: 22nd Nov 06
Location: West Yorkshire
User status: Offline
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Always have a Stanley knife in my work pants. Along with other crap for work so I don't think I'd be bother by the police for that.
Lock knife in your best trackies is a different story.
Mate of mine always used to carry a leatherman with him 24/7 and never had any issues.
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