Nath
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Registered: 3rd Apr 02
Location: MK
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I saw an asian guy driving a BMW M3 convertible with fogs and sidelights on. This was at 3pm today!!! Was it foggy, NO! Was it dark or was visibilty poor, NO!
WTF is that about? Does he seriously think its cool or what?
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vibrio
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Registered: 28th Feb 01
Location: POAH
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quote:
Originally posted by Nath
I saw an asian guy driving a BMW M3 convertible with fogs and sidelights on. This was at 3pm today!!! Was it foggy, NO! Was it dark or was visibilty poor, NO!
WTF is that about? Does he seriously think its cool or what?
it was dark in the drivers seat 
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Nath
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Registered: 3rd Apr 02
Location: MK
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Joff
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Registered: 17th Oct 00
Location: Cambridgeshire
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I suppose it's the same for those that drive with Neon washer jets... what are they for? Are they that proud of having a car with washer jets (because their last one/bmx didn't???) they have to illuminate them??
HGV drivers love them too...  ....
...and Yorkies.
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Joff
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Registered: 17th Oct 00
Location: Cambridgeshire
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quote:
Originally posted by vibrio
quote:
Originally posted by Nath
I saw an asian guy driving a BMW M3 convertible with fogs and sidelights on. This was at 3pm today!!! Was it foggy, NO! Was it dark or was visibilty poor, NO!
WTF is that about? Does he seriously think its cool or what?
it was dark in the drivers seat
Yes, my dashboard has a blue light when I've got main beam on. Maybe his favourite colour is displayed when he puts his fog lights on.
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Nath
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Registered: 3rd Apr 02
Location: MK
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HGV drivers have neon fetishes
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chrisfitton
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Registered: 6th Jul 01
Location: Kelsall between Northwich and Chester
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if its really thick fog (say like hrdly see 2Meters in front of ya) ive been recommened by many police in traffic to drive with foglights and sidelights only. As with main beam your light just bounces off the fog and u cant see a thing but with foglights and sidelights only, the fog lights undercut the fog light enabeling you to see the road a hell of alot better than with main beam on.
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Joff
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Registered: 17th Oct 00
Location: Cambridgeshire
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If it's really REALLY foggy, I find it best to speed through it as quickly as possible till you get into better visibility.
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Nath
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Registered: 3rd Apr 02
Location: MK
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If you speed when its foggy you will get through it in less time. I like Joff's thinking.
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Joff
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Registered: 17th Oct 00
Location: Cambridgeshire
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I seem to remember a sarcastic image showing a car with it's sidelights on - has anyone got this??
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el gordo
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Registered: 21st Dec 03
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quote:
Originally posted by Ian
Its actually legal to drive with fog lights on if you're not also displaying dipped beam and you're in a 30 limit. Not a lot of people know that 
Oh aye - and where is that mentioned in statute?
I'd love to know which part of the highway code, or legal reference you're using, as the highway code, the law and ACPO guidelines dictate otherwise.
The highway code also circumvents the Foglight and Driving light argument by covering them both in one (Not to mention the fact that driving lights are of similar intensity to Fog Lights but have a beam pattern that sends the light in the same way as the headlight, and so affects people further away and at a higher level, so are in fact MORE dangerous).
I'm quite looking forward to this...
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paul_spurrell
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Registered: 14th Sep 01
Location: Bath Avon
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in the high way code it recomends driving in fog with side lights and fogs, especially in built up areas or when driving close to other viehcles
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el gordo
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Registered: 21st Dec 03
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key point - in fog...
i.e. severely reduced visibility.
I'd also like to see how Ian's theory stands up to the Designation of Approval Marks Regulations.
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stuyw
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Registered: 15th May 02
Location: North West Drives: Rev3 MR2 Turbo
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ive actually found out, that pressing the fog light switch again, does indeed switch them off. Wonder if other people know this as there are so many tossers driving around with them still switched on 
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el gordo
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Registered: 21st Dec 03
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by the way, for informational purposes, and to clarify beyond doubt...
quote:
Highway Code:-
94. You MUST NOT
use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to other road users
use front or rear fog lights unless visibility is seriously reduced. You MUST switch them off when visibility improves to avoid dazzling other road users.
Law RVLR reg 27
201. You MUST use headlights when visibility is seriously reduced, generally when you cannot see for more than 100 metres (328 feet). You may also use front or rear fog lights (in addition to headlights) but you MUST switch them off when visibility improves (see rule 211).
Law RVLR regs 25 & 27
211. You MUST NOT use front or rear fog lights unless visibility is seriously reduced (see rule 201) as they dazzle other road users and can obscure your brake lights. You MUST switch them off when visibility improves.
Law RVLR regs 25 & 27
and then this follows from the ACPO, clarifies it is an offence and it is recommended they prosecute instead of warn:
ACPO Home Office Guideline "Offence Group 21", CJS code RL 89163, Statue R27 RVLR 89 "Misuse of lamps: - fog lamps (front/rear)" with a recommendation of prosecution rather than warning, and a VDRN if necessary.
This means you'll be done for it, not told off if the copper is following the guidelines (only superceded by local directives to tollerate or clamp down). This also means if they're on because they're faulty, and you fail to fix it in a set time, then your car can be impounded and even crushed, so don't even THINK about hard-wiring them on...
As for people who claim theirs are driving lights and as a result aren't as bad... WRONG!!! They're worse!
A: represents the wide and low beam pattern of a standard fog light. Standard fog lights will help widen your field of vision in fog and other circumstances of poor visibility, especially on single lane highways and country roads.
B: represents the wide and low pattern of a projector fog light. Projector fog lights are usually slightly more expensive than standard fog lights but provide a brighter, longer beam.
C: represents the narrow and long pattern cast by an auxiliary driving light. Auxiliary driving lights are helpful for driving in poor lighting conditions where your forward vision is an issue.
So, similar intensities but the beam is cast higher, further and more "in your face" than fogs - so don't hide behind "ooh, it's ok, they're not real fog lamps" cos they're worse! The law allows for any lights which dazzle, not just fogs.
I'm sure anyone who rides motorbikes, drives SUV's or 4x4s or other high-set road-view position vehicles (as well as driving regular cars) can testify how painful it is to be met by oncoming fogs, and even worse 'driving' lights' in night, and even in daytime are dazzled by them. The motorbike circumstance is made worse by the curvature of the visor, and the fact that tints are illegal so there's no protection whatsoever.
PS - rain isn't a circumstance to try them out either, as the reflection back from the road simply adds to the problem.
Oooh, and another thing - if your kits are wired to flick the fogs or aux-driving lights on when you go to full-beam (so out in the sticks, or when flashing people) then again, it's still an offence as the minute they light up, the wrong lens-type is being used as a headlight and there's the whole issue I mentioned earlier about "Designation of Approval Marks" Regulations to back this up.
Finally, according to a chap I know who's still current job (traffic), as well as 2 others who are ex-job, foglights with window down usually gets a tug and a breathalyser cos pissheads tend to drive with the window down, and not realise their fogs are on (or try to look cool by putting them on) and it's a perfect chance to check for drugs, knives, stolen goods - so a 3 minute pull can be turned into a 20 minute grilling and REALLY inconvenience you. If you'd had the fogs off? Probably no pull. Add a baseball cap in and they'll be even more likely to go for the bait and put the cap on arse about face, and yer asking for it (and usually fail what most coppers term the "attitude test" for behaviour when stopped, respect shown toward the law, cooperation in execution of duty [they want it over with as fast as you do, just do as you're told!] though this decreases in severity if there's no audience from mates, girlfriend or bystanders). 2 of them reckoned they had colleagues who considered it "fun" to play with the 'hot hatches'" and pull them as often as practical, depending on how busy it was, cos of the likelihood of finding illegal goods, illegal motors, people with outstanding warrants etc etc. They'd be more likely to pull if the fogs were on, purely for considering the driver a prize twat.
so, is it REALLY worth the hassle, let alone the real danger you're causing to other road users, just so your pinhead mates think yer tricked up motor looks a bit cooler with them on?
</rant>
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Nath
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Registered: 3rd Apr 02
Location: MK
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Its MR.Highway Code!!
[Edited on 22-12-2003 by Nath]
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el gordo
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Registered: 21st Dec 03
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nah, just mr sick-of-being-dazzled, and his alter ego, mr likes-to-put-whining-excuse-makers-back-in-their-box.
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Nath
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Registered: 3rd Apr 02
Location: MK
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 ok 
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el gordo
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Registered: 21st Dec 03
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Joff
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Registered: 17th Oct 00
Location: Cambridgeshire
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Can you explain the whole "horses on roundabouts" thing??
I skipped that question on my theory test - if a rider takes his/her horse onto a roundabout then they should expect to get glue!!
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paul_spurrell
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Registered: 14th Sep 01
Location: Bath Avon
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quote:
Originally posted by el gordo
quote:
They'd be more likely to pull if the fogs were on, purely for considering the driver a prize twat.
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vibrio
Banned
Registered: 28th Feb 01
Location: POAH
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quote:
Originally posted by Joff
Can you explain the whole "horses on roundabouts" thing??
I skipped that question on my theory test - if a rider takes his/her horse onto a roundabout then they should expect to get glue!!
what about the whole give room to cyclists crap
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Robbo
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Registered: 6th Aug 02
Location: London
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I got a bollocking once for driving with my fogs on in normal light, thank god I have now seen the error of my ways :S
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el gordo
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Registered: 21st Dec 03
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quote:
Originally posted by RobboSRi
<--- It's Christmas 
You should see the inside of my shed
last count was around 96 cans of beer, 4 crates of wine, 3 crates of smirnoff ice, 8 bottles of voddie and a dozen or so different spirits.
then there's the wine kept in the house
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Joff
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Registered: 17th Oct 00
Location: Cambridgeshire
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quote:
Originally posted by Robbo
I got a bollocking once for driving with my fogs on in normal light, thank god I have now seen the error of my ways :S
What did this bollocking consist of?
Them telling you that having fogs on was illegal or that you looked a prize turnip for driving with them on?
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