Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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Yes but my point is, the developers designed it to be played with a controller...
I'm not saying the developers couldn't have made the most realistic racer if they had wanted to, I have no doubts they could of! But they designed the game to be easy to play and to be played on a game pad (with optional wheel etc)... As a result the physics in Forza 2 simulate realism, but arn't 'realistic' - i.e. they're forgiving to make ease of play. In reality if you are in a bend on a track at high speed and lift off / brake you'll completely lose it.
In these games, Forza 2, GT4 etc - you can get away with it, as the physics programmers program it to constantly keep the car in control - albeit still allowing you to slide / spin / oversteer / understeer etc!
For a console game Forza 2 is probably one of the best for realism, but it's not the most realistic driving game by anyway.
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Steve
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Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
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actually you will find the developers designed it more for the wheel then the controller. The force feedback was perfect, in all the right places, the steering goes light when you lose front end traction etc
i can tell you now that in forza if you try and take a bend too fast you lose it very easily
were you playing with all assists turned on?
and dont utter gt4 in the same sentence as fm2 as the physics dont even come close in gt4
in fact have you even played fm2? as if you had
a) you would know that you cant just throw it into a corner and the physics control it for you
b) it plays nothing like gt4
[Edited on 24-10-2007 by Steve]
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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here's an example of what I mean Steve...
People claim GT4 is realistic! (I know you don't)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yPfCoHErp1c
Yes I've played Forza 2, but only on a pad! I found a lot of similarities between Gt4 physics and FM2 to be honest, similar 'care bear' approach.. Though FM2 was better in a lot of ways.
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Steve
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Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
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yes thats gt4 it has god awful physics, fm2 has good physics,
seriously did you have assists turned off? as i found it had zero care bear approachs for you and in some cases i found it harder to control then real life
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Ian
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Registered: 28th Aug 99
Location: Liverpool
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2a6OeM8m8w
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Steve
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Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
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thats just lag buggering it up due to multiplayer
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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This is what I mean steve... look at this car drifting
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFGVoaS8VPU
Quite often during that video mid drift, the front wheels are just doing nothing (obviously played on pad) - rather than the car losing control completely there is undelying programming that is helping the player control the car... Yes the car is oversteering / sliding and drifting  but this isn't a realistic simulation of how that Skyline would handle if you tried to drift it for real?
Would you be able to maintain the perfect drift just by turning in then holding the wheel straight and planting the throttle, then putting a little bit of opposite lock at the end to correct? I don't think so... it'd need a fine balance in steering / throttle throughout.
Now watch this, a personal fave game of mine (not for the graphics or sound though!) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFmfWgnLEw0
Watch mid drift the amount of corrections these guys are making just to the steering... Note to be able to do this in game requires a massive amount of skill and a wheel. These guys are extremely good.
an example of someone doing it with the wheel (seeing them drive)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqD0JMblGZM
throughout most of this ^^ they would lose it completely if they weren't in control. (i.e. not using a wheel)
Here's a couple of slow mo vids - showing the physics, tyre deformation, suspension etc... Notice how the FWD when pushed is understeering etc.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdldZlNDm80
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWwH9cNDf2E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fp-TrU_iVlU
and finally a vid which sums up why I and many others play this game... it's online, requires skill and the gameplay is fantastic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAvj0iY1Zig
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Schlumpfy
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Registered: 2nd Apr 07
Location: Stourbridge, West Midlands
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Live For Speed 
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Steve
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Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
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iv played live for speed, and imo the physics were a lot better in fm2,
paul the guy drifting that skyline must be well practised at FM2 as it is not easy to do that let me tell you, i dont see a lot wrong with how it handled compared to real life
[Edited on 24-10-2007 by Steve]
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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quote:
Originally posted by Steve
iv played live for speed, and imo the physics were a lot better in fm2,
paul the guy drifting that skyline must be well practised at FM2 as it is not easy to do that let me tell you, i dont see a lot wrong with how it handled compared to real life
[Edited on 24-10-2007 by Steve]
You see, I haven't played FM2 with a wheel? So I think that's why I've pre judged it... I think they've probably dumbed it down for a pad. Though I think any game should come without assists / pad support 
Yeh LFS has been around for years, but played with a wheel it's immense online. Those vids don't do it justice. The other thing is, online in LFS it's about actual skill, i.e. to be the quickest you need a wheel, and you need to drive properly. In FM2 online you could be racing against someone on a pad with most assists and they'll just micky mouse their way to the finish line.
I need to play FM2 with a wheel I think.
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Steve
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Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
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yeah its a much better experience, i probably wouldnt bother with it if i didnt have the wheel
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Jake
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Registered: 24th Jan 05
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quote:
Originally posted by loafofbrett
quote:
Originally posted by Paul_J
hope the physics are a tad more realistic than carbon!
WTF?!?!?! I buy NFS specifically because it's unrealistic. I don't want to have to brake round corners and I want to be able to take 90 degree bends at 120mph!
If I wanted a proper driving game i'd stick Forza in.
I hope to god it's similar to Carbon.
fucking right I loved Gran Turismo 2 for the fact you can use other cars and barriers to slow down and get around corners
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simon179
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Registered: 6th Aug 07
Location: southport
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nooooooooo!
i wanit
but nooooo too many awesome new games out lol like crysis next munf! football manager 2008, PES and FIFA GTA4, GT5 all these an stil make time for BF2 am never gna see daylight again lol
mind u saves on petrol an atleas ma car will have less milage 
Top year for games 
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Schlumpfy
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Registered: 2nd Apr 07
Location: Stourbridge, West Midlands
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Not really Fable 2 is put back along with GTA 
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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This vid makes it look like the new 'pro street' will be slightly better than previous
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixEzYywGU_c
Car seems to be more oversteery / slidey.. the guys having to counter steer quite often and actually spins it once.
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Calum
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Registered: 2nd Sep 06
Location: Edinburgh, City of Edinburgh
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^^
That game is L.A.Street Racing
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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ah - thought the graphics looked a bit shit.
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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ahh ^^ that game is made by invictus, which explains why the physics is probably alright ish... Same people who did Redline racing 2... hmm may check that out.
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Steve
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Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
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just played the demo, worst game ever
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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quote:
Originally posted by Steve
just played the demo, worst game ever
demo of what? pro street?
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Dan295
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Registered: 9th Oct 06
Location: London
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i cant wait for this one, looks proper good and by the looks of it if you crash you damage your car, i like this
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Steve
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Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
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quote:
Originally posted by Paul_J
quote:
Originally posted by Steve
just played the demo, worst game ever
demo of what? pro street?
yes
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dannymccann
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Registered: 9th Aug 06
Location: Doddington, Lincolnshire
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just played ProStreet demo and i have to say im not a huge fan, i had it on King and it was still braking for me when i didnt want it to and like someone said before, if it aint as good as Forza it just isnt worth playing now
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Doug
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Registered: 8th Oct 03
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There are no decent driving games on the horizon are there?
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Steve
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Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
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tbh im a bit bored of driving games after forza
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