Nath
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Leeds didnt lose points in the Prem though. Pompey are the only Prem team to ever enter Admin.
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mwg
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Registered: 19th Feb 04
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soon to be joined by Liverpool
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Dr Pepper
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Registered: 21st Sep 02
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quote:
Originally posted by Nath
Leeds didnt lose points in the Prem though. Pompey are the only Prem team to ever enter Admin.
Yeah I know ... but it wasnt the points deduction that got pompey relegated .. it was trying to avoid one by selling off all their assists to try and reduce or service the debt. If Hicks and co hold on to the club - they will have to do something very similar in the transfer window as far as I can see... unless im mising something I dont see what other plan they have to keep the club and pay the money back other than using the clubs assets - ie the players
Obviously if the take over goes through then it should turn out ok. ...... but thats a hell of an assumption to make.
I would be very worried if I was a liverpool fan right now...Im not saying they are doomed at all .... but the more infomation comes to light the more scary it looks - this court case is gigantic for them.
Having seen them play 3 or 4 times this season .... I would be too confident of any sort of rapid climb up the table unless they can buy new players in january. Other than Torress, Gerard and Reina I dont think they are much better than the other clubs around them at the moment.
[Edited on 08-10-2010 by Dr Pepper]
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Tom
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
quote:
Originally posted by strick206
quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
If you get a 9 point deduction would that put off the new buyers? I dont know enough about the new buyers to say? It would make relegation a substantial posibility - I know it would put me off buying the club if they were 9 points worse off.
No chance would it put me off, Liverpool are never going to get relegated, even with 9 points off they will comfortably stay up
What about if Hicks and co win, they go into administartion and reina, gerrard and torres leave in january ... dont think they would be any better than the bottom half teams without them .... they havnt been better than blackpool with them so far
Thats not likely but this is very dodgy for Liverpool at the moment - there will be a few really worried people at that club at the moment ... disgracefull really that a club like Liverpool can be taken down this sort of path.
The outcome of H&G vs the board is nowhere near 50/50. Broughton would NEVER have put his neck on the line and announced this without having a water tight case to back it up, it's more than his massive reputation is worth. It's quite likely that they will lose and appeal but it's also been suggested by most that an appeal would also be fast tracked (i.e. within a week of lodging). Hicks is probably going to base his court action on the fact that liverpool was sold below market value/there wasn't reasonable effort put into trying to find suitable owners which is all rubbish. Again there appeal will probably be based around something the court would regard as frivilous, the fact of the matter is that H&G gave the board 100% control of the sale as they were between a rock & a hard place with RBS so they had no option. the only way they will retain control of the club is if they find the money to refinance the debts from elsewhere which is very unlikely.
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Tom
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
quote:
Originally posted by Tom
quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
quote:
Originally posted by strick206
IMO there is no chance the league will dock liverpool points, doubt the sale will go through by then anyway but RBS will most likely wait, then if Hicks and Gilette win in court blocking the sale (doubt that too) RBS will then opt to put them into administration
I agree that is the likely scenario ... but its a bit dodgy when you are 'hoping' that RBS dont claim back money that is theirs to take. Big banks are not known for having much compassion or patience
No offence mate but you probably don't understand the situation well enough to start calling it dodgy. RBS would prefer not to put us into administration, they see it as a big PR headache that they don't want any part of and it was the case even a week ago that fans were trying to pressure them into DOING just that, they would rather a sale was overseen by Broughton. As stated, it's complex situation and I very much doubt that the league would feel comfortable putting -9 against us as this early stage, there's a lot of trigger points that would need to be met first. As I say though, if that's what it takes to get them out then so be it. I don't see us going down though even if it were to happen.
Of course RBS prefer the takeover.... they get paid. All im saying is that this court case is massive for Liverpool. Its a position that no one at the club would want and it is very dodgy for them.
What leads you to beleive they wouldn't get paid if they let H&G retain control? They have refinanced with them several times where they have earned all sorts of extra interest and fines. They have probably 'made' about £80+m from lfc already. The point is that they can hold out for x amount of months and avoid a PR disaster if needs be.
[Edited on 08-10-2010 by Tom]
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Ben D
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I think it's a bit unscrupulous of the board to sell the club from under them for such a reduced figure, leaving them at such a loss if I'm honest.
With this in mind it wouldn't surprise me if Hicks & Gillette held a grudge and left them in a bad way as a parting shot by seeing them hit with a 9 point deduction.
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Dr Pepper
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Registered: 21st Sep 02
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quote:
Originally posted by Tom
quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
quote:
Originally posted by strick206
quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
If you get a 9 point deduction would that put off the new buyers? I dont know enough about the new buyers to say? It would make relegation a substantial posibility - I know it would put me off buying the club if they were 9 points worse off.
No chance would it put me off, Liverpool are never going to get relegated, even with 9 points off they will comfortably stay up
What about if Hicks and co win, they go into administartion and reina, gerrard and torres leave in january ... dont think they would be any better than the bottom half teams without them .... they havnt been better than blackpool with them so far
Thats not likely but this is very dodgy for Liverpool at the moment - there will be a few really worried people at that club at the moment ... disgracefull really that a club like Liverpool can be taken down this sort of path.
The outcome of H&G vs the board is nowhere near 50/50. Broughton would NEVER have put his neck on the line and announced this without having a water tight case to back it up, it's more than his massive reputation is worth. It's quite likely that they will lose and appeal but it's also been suggested by most that an appeal would also be fast tracked (i.e. within a week of lodging). Hicks is probably going to base his court action on the fact that liverpool was sold below market value/there wasn't reasonable effort put into trying to find suitable owners which is all rubbish. Again there appeal will probably be based around something the court would regard as frivilous, the fact of the matter is that H&G gave the board 100% control of the sale as they were between a rock & a hard place with RBS so they had no option. the only way they will retain control of the club is if they find the money to refinance the debts from elsewhere which is very unlikely.
Mate- im not arguing - that is the most llikely outcome. But you dont know what is going to happen in that court room .... h&g are not stupid men and im sure they have a good legal team ... I would be worried if I was a liverpool fan at the moment. Untill a takeover is 100% done it is dangerous place for the club to be in. I would aso worry about how much infomation h & g are keeping hidden.
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Tom
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Location: Wirral, Merseyside
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quote:
Originally posted by Ben D
I think it's a bit unscrupulous of the board to sell the club from under them for such a reduced figure, leaving them at such a loss if I'm honest.
With this in mind it wouldn't surprise me if Hicks & Gillette held a grudge and left them in a bad way as a parting shot by seeing them hit with a 9 point deduction.
Are you Harry Redknapp?
You think (3 of) our board have acted unscrupulously?! The cancers haven't really lost anything, the £140m they 'loaned' to the club was the clubs profits since they'd taken over. They haven't put anything from their own pocket into the club. The reason the lost control of these decisions is because they bought the club with someone elses money and couldn't get finance to build a new stadium, they are incompetent and have lumped more and more debt (through refinancing) onto the club since day one, if they were left to try and sell the club for £600m or whatever they 'think' it's worth, they'd still be looking for a buyer in 2015, and they'd still be lumping more and more debt onto the club until it no longer existed. They should never have been allowed to take control, they were the ones who acted unscrupulously when they bought the club, and I quote "We have purchased the club with no debt on the club,". They have a history of fucking sports franchises over.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/l/liverpool/6323037.stm
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Dr Pepper
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What leads you to beleive they wouldn't get paid if they let H&G retain control? They have refinanced with them several times where they have earned all sorts of extra interest and fines. They have probably 'made' about £80+m from lfc already. The point is that they can hold out for x amount of months and avoid a PR disaster if needs be.
[Edited on 08-10-2010 by Tom]
They have paid £80mill plus so far to Rbs ... they had resources they could sell, champs league money and a full stadium so money was coming in. Eventually you will hit breaking point - the money will not be there to service the loan - you wont have players to sell and you wont be paying the players wages. Yes RBS have done well so far out of the club - you cant expect that to continue for ever though.
This takeover is crucial - if you dont get it I think you stand a great chance of going down..... looking at the fact that some bookies have got you as less than 12-1 to go down I would not say it is a fantastic position for the club to be in ..... its much more serious than I thought it was - just because I do think H&G stand a decent chance of winning this court case.
I genuinely have no idea why anyone with a fortune of less than £1billion pounds would want to but liverpool at the moment. You are talking about having to spend £500million to buy the club, pay the debts and get the personel in to get back into the top four. Then you are still worse off as Arsenal and Man u are getting £1.5million per game from their ground - so you need to finance a new ground as well at some point...... its a hell of a risk for anyone to take on at the moment... I do accept the potential new owners have a much better record in sports franchises than the previous ones did.
[Edited on 08-10-2010 by Dr Pepper]
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Tom
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
Mate- im not arguing - that is the most llikely outcome. But you dont know what is going to happen in that court room .... h&g are not stupid men and im sure they have a good legal team ... I would be worried if I was a liverpool fan at the moment. Untill a takeover is 100% done it is dangerous place for the club to be in. I would aso worry about how much infomation h & g are keeping hidden.
Of course it's a worrying situation, but I firmly beleive this is one last ditched, desperate attempt from them, they know they are beaten but they have nothing else to try. It speaks volumes that this is going to pretty much ruin the both considering how many franshises they have been involved in over the years.
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Dr Pepper
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quote:
Originally posted by Tom
quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
Mate- im not arguing - that is the most llikely outcome. But you dont know what is going to happen in that court room .... h&g are not stupid men and im sure they have a good legal team ... I would be worried if I was a liverpool fan at the moment. Untill a takeover is 100% done it is dangerous place for the club to be in. I would aso worry about how much infomation h & g are keeping hidden.
Of course it's a worrying situation, but I firmly beleive this is one last ditched, desperate attempt from them, they know they are beaten but they have nothing else to try. It speaks volumes that this is going to pretty much ruin the both considering how many franshises they have been involved in over the years.
I genuinely hope you are right .... I hated benitez's liverpool team but they are a club that belongs at the top of English football .... would be unforgivable if things went tits up there.
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Steve
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Registered: 30th Mar 02
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cosmo is going to go mad when he sees this, he will fight everyone that has replied in this thread
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Ben J
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Fuck me.
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mwg
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Registered: 19th Feb 04
Location: South Lakes
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quote:
Originally posted by Steve
cosmo is going to go mad when he sees this, he will fight everyone that has replied in this thread
Cosmo is actually in charge of the sale of LFC
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Dr Pepper
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I do genuinely find it suprising that there are Man U fans all over the net laughing their tits off at this news. Do they not have any idea what the situation is at their own club? if you look at the situation at Old Trafford and the recent figures coming out of the club I dont really think they should be laughing too hard....very similar situation - hostile owners in financial trouble who can only keep their heads afloat by using the clubs assets, spiraling debts and the only profit coming from selling their best players .... If I was a Man u fan I wouldnt be laughing too hard - could be you next.
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mwg
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Registered: 19th Feb 04
Location: South Lakes
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WHAT
Dont be daft
[Edited on 08-10-2010 by mwg]
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DC90
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As much as I hate liverpool, their fans, their players, their fucking attitude, it's a shame to see the way things have gone lately.
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strick206
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr Pepper
Both Leeds and Portsmouth went from Europe to championship and administration within two seasons...its not like this kind of thing doesnt happen in the premiership.
I'm a United fan, and as much as this pleases me greatly there is one big difference with what you have posted in the quote
Leeds and Pompey were both losing money hands over fist, the club was losing money, this is not the case at Liverpool, they are making a decent profit even with all this going on, so they won't go into administration
United are very similar i agree, although on a bigger scale but again, a much bigger club. United are making massive operating profits, (the first premierleague club to go over 100 million) in fact our operating profit is less than 25 million away from super club city's turnover 
United are ok at the moment, because they will continue to service the debt by the interest payments etc every year until the bonds are due (in 7 years), then we will see what the situation is
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Marc
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Registered: 11th Aug 02
Location: York
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Wheres the traditional, Cosmo, Debt, Big Fat Gayer spin? 
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cavmad
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quote:
Originally posted by DC90
As much as I hate liverpool, their fans, their players, their fucking attitude, it's great to see the way things have gone lately.
Edited for accuracy.
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Nath
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Registered: 3rd Apr 02
Location: MK
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quote:
Originally posted by Marc
Wheres the traditional, Cosmo, Debt, Big Fat Gayer spin?
One moment....
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Marc
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Ben D
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Even Martin Broughton is admitting it's a very real possibility of receiving a point's deduction
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11669_6435459,00.html
Anybody else think he look like Sir Ian Mckellen? [Gandalf]
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Rick Draper
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Buyers will walk if they get a points deduction.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1319226/Liverpool-deal-brink-collapse-US-buyers-walk-away-club-docked-points.html
50/50 chance of winning the court case.
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Ben D
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More reason to hope for a points deduction then
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