big eck
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Registered: 20th Apr 03
Location: Tullibody. Drives - Audi B8 S4 & Fiesta Zetec-S
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Its just been a racing incident by the looks of it then.
Thats exactly why I would never put my car on track. Its not my driving i'd worry about its someone else hitting me.
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AK
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Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
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quote:
If it was a problem with the car then surely pulling off would have been the safer thing to do. Its all easily said that you can see the civic from a good bit back but if your a few cars back and goin through a quick section of track and your focused on the car in front then the last thing your gonna be watching out for is someone at a crawl casually driving over the apex of a raised hill knowing theres cars racing you behind you.
...and the civic should be expected to just get the hell off the track via the grass/tyres just because he is slow 
It is a trackday - full of like minded enthousiasts. Not a race day.
On a trackday you SHOULD be paying attention beyond the bumper in front of you. Same as driving on public roads.
I have a vid somewhere of a near miss just after the chicane (on TrackScotland youtube channel).
A car is stopped dead on the left of a straight....
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AK
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Location: Aberdeen City
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quote:
Originally posted by big eck
Its just been a racing incident by the looks of it then.
Thats exactly why I would never put my car on track. Its not my driving i'd worry about its someone else hitting me.
Racing Incident - on a public trackday?!?!
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big eck
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Registered: 20th Apr 03
Location: Tullibody. Drives - Audi B8 S4 & Fiesta Zetec-S
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I never said he should get off track because he was slow, read it again, I said if the car had a problem. Thats what I would personally do as I wouldnt want to have some car running right into the back of me.
And do you honestly think that the people that run there cars on track aint racing
Paying attention on public roads and doing the same on a race track is very different I would imagine. You aint exactly putting your car on the limit going throught an "S" bend right on the bumper with another car doing the same on the way to your local tescos.
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Fee
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Registered: 16th Nov 05
Location: With AK
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I wouldnt even be able to count the amount of times that cars in front of me have slowed down around the twistie bits of the track to let me past.
9 times out of 10 I will still not pass...the rules are simple, on the straights AND with the consent of the driver in front moving to the right to let you past...it's not an either/or
The Civic shouldnt have moved over to let the evos past but I can understand why he might have felt intimidated by them being on his arse and made the decision to move over
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big eck
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Registered: 20th Apr 03
Location: Tullibody. Drives - Audi B8 S4 & Fiesta Zetec-S
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quote:
Originally posted by Fee
I wouldnt even be able to count the amount of times that cars in front of me have slowed down around the twistie bits of the track to let me past.
9 times out of 10 I will still not pass...the rules are simple, on the straights AND with the consent of the driver in front moving to the right to let you past...it's not an either/or
The Civic shouldnt have moved over to let the evos past but I can understand why he might have felt intimidated by them being on his arse and made the decision to move over
I agree with you. Hes probably panicked and hit the brakes in the wrong area. The fella in the 205 hasnt expected to see any car that slow and obviously tried to pass which again was wrong and ran into him.
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Steve
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Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
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The following isnt aimed at anyone 
This thread is like the plane taking off the conveyor belt you get 3 types of people
those that can see the correct answer straight away.
those, that are a bit slower and start by suggesting the wrong answer but eventually come round to understanding the correct answer
those that seriously lack grey matter and persist on about justifying why there incorrect view is actually correct.
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AK
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Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
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am4nf
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Registered: 27th Jul 08
Location: South Ayrshire Drives: Corsa Sport
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quote:
Originally posted by AK
quote:
If it was a problem with the car then surely pulling off would have been the safer thing to do. Its all easily said that you can see the civic from a good bit back but if your a few cars back and goin through a quick section of track and your focused on the car in front then the last thing your gonna be watching out for is someone at a crawl casually driving over the apex of a raised hill knowing theres cars racing you behind you.
...and the civic should be expected to just get the hell off the track via the grass/tyres just because he is slow
It is a trackday - full of like minded enthousiasts. Not a race day.
On a trackday you SHOULD be paying attention beyond the bumper in front of you. Same as driving on public roads.
I have a vid somewhere of a near miss just after the chicane (on TrackScotland youtube channel).
A car is stopped dead on the left of a straight....
Lets c
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Ben G
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Registered: 12th Jan 07
Location: Essex
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quote:
Originally posted by Steve
The following isnt aimed at anyone
This thread is like the plane taking off the conveyor belt you get 3 types of people
those that can see the correct answer straight away.
those, that are a bit slower and start by suggesting the wrong answer but eventually come round to understanding the correct answer
those that seriously lack grey matter and persist on about justifying why there incorrect view is actually correct.
the intelligent ones being the option 1 people
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AK
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Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
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My connection is slow and I dont know which vid exactly -
I think it was a wet trackday, in the Impreza so that should narrow things down. It was a mini beached on track.
http://www.youtube.com/user/TrackScotland
post a link if you find it
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Daimo B
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Registered: 20th Mar 00
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quote:
Originally posted by big eck
I never said he should get off track because he was slow, read it again, I said if the car had a problem. Thats what I would personally do as I wouldnt want to have some car running right into the back of me.
And do you honestly think that the people that run there cars on track aint racing
Paying attention on public roads and doing the same on a race track is very different I would imagine. You aint exactly putting your car on the limit going throught an "S" bend right on the bumper with another car doing the same on the way to your local tescos.
Errrrr, thats obviously a mentality thing then.
I never raced my corsa, I drove it as hard as i could within my limits.
Likewise with my bike, i never race anyone else, nor get red mist, im there for me and to enjoy myself. I take my line, its down to the people BEHINED to take avoiding action to avoid a collision.
And if I do have someone faster, I move to the side, admittidly at a better spot, but this chap done nothing hugely wwrong other than get out the way at the wrong point.
The accident itself, is still totally the pugs fault.
If someone rams you because you had to do an emergency stop, is it your fault, or the person ramming? Its the person behined to ensure no contact is made. He should have rolled off the throttle, waited to get round the right hander, pulled to the left and continued past.
Personnally, I think the Pug was driving fast and was trying to keep up with the cossie on the bends, but thats my opinion. Too busy looking at chasing the cossie instead of looking ahead.
Edit: I did get red mist actually in the VXR, and ruined my last session, my own fault though. Should have dropped back, let person carry on, then get back on it.
[Edited on 26-07-2010 by Daimo B]
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AK
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Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
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On occaision I push on trackdays... but maybe 80%. The one time I competed at Snetterton I was pushing a lot harder.
I think Fee prob goes at about 60% on trackdays I have to tell her to get closer to folk so they KNOW you want past.
The majority of people genuinely dont race on trackdays. I have vids on youtube where it might look like racing ( Impreza vs Format Sale EVO) but its just fun and well well within limits, safe braking etc. I was actually MUCH quicker on corners (in Impreza) but could not pass on straights.
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AK
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Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
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havent watched it but think this may be it... may not be as 'near miss' as I remember but i'll comment once its loaded - 1hr perhaps
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbg4alKVwUM
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BarnshaW
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Registered: 25th Oct 06
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excuse me sirs, can i just ask, does the highway code apply on the racetrack? if not then what does stopping distances have to do with this?
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Ian
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Registered: 28th Aug 99
Location: Liverpool
User status: Online
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quote:
Originally posted by BarnshaW
what does stopping distances have to do with this?
Because evidently, you sometimes need to stop!
Highway Code doesn't apply but there are rules - which these guys all broke.
And a bit more perception, in keeping with regular driving, would have helped.
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big eck
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Registered: 20th Apr 03
Location: Tullibody. Drives - Audi B8 S4 & Fiesta Zetec-S
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All i'm saying is i'm very suprised to see the civic goin so slowly on that piece of track. Obviously all the lewis hamiltons that have done the odd track days on here know better but I'm just commenting on what I can see in the vid.
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BarnshaW
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Registered: 25th Oct 06
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I say its 50/50 personally, I am not a track expert and have never been on track but can see the error on both sides. As said before its good no one got hurt.
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AK
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Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
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in that vid i posted above - I passed the mini that I later nearly rear end at the same place
Doh - pot kettle black.
He clearly saw me and moved over though, and I wasnt pressuring him for ages.
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AK
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Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
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aye, just re-watched - he indicated to let me know 
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AK
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Location: Aberdeen City
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6m30 in - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbg4alKVwUM
could have been messy
7m24 in - good fun
[Edited on 26-07-2010 by AK]
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Ian
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Registered: 28th Aug 99
Location: Liverpool
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quote:
Originally posted by AK
6m30 in - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbg4alKVwUM
could have been messy
What the hell 
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Steve
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Registered: 30th Mar 02
Location: Worcestershire Drives: Defender
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDEWFpD3eW8
8:25 lolz
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emicen
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Registered: 26th Jul 10
Location: Glasgow
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To expand on my previous point (now I'm breaking cover and not pretending to be laura anymore):
The section through Butchers and in to the chicance is not a place you want to be passing. If you can get down the inside in to Butchers its worth a shot but anything side by side in to the chicane has disaster written all over it, its a very narrow piece of track to try driving side by side. Now, I'm saying that in a racing context where you know what the other person is going to do. I know they're going to cut a shit load of kerb to give more room and I know roughly where they'll brake. Even then, you'll lose so much speed anyone within 50yds behind you will get you on the run up to Clarks. (hence having to sit tight and actually brake this weekend in that situation cause the car behind was too close to lose ground to by trying a move)
On a track day you cant go down the inside in to Butchers (shouldnt be passing there full stop on most track days) hence you definately shouldnt be passing coming in to or through the chicane. Regardless of whether or not the person is moving over to let you do so.
The Evos really shouldnt have gotten so close but their thinking can be explained by the comment above about most people on a trackday racing. Most idiots race on track days, most people just drive their car hard but against themselves only, unless they know the other people involved like Adam and the Format boys. I've been in David Sleigh's Mini where he closed a gap of >100m on the leading car just through Duffus and Leslies, sat behind the car all the way till the exit of the chicance then the muppet boots it up the back straight forcing Dave to go late on the brakes in to Clarks and then said muppet posts all over a forum about Dave's driving being unacceptable. That is more than likely why the Evos got so close, making the point clear to someone who is playing the same silly "but look, I can boot it in a straight line" game that they wanted past.
The 3 types of people comment is proving quite accurate in this case. You get the disingenuous comments about "lewis hamiltons" getting made where some of Scotland's most experienced private track day organisers are commenting (Adam and Fee). I'm not the Stig, I've got the tyre burns to prove it, but whilst yesterday I was through that section of track 30cms off some people's bumpers, I wouldnt go through it 30m off someone's bumper on a public track day.
Get the feeling as a first post that isnt going to win me friends but rest assured, I would say the same thing on it in person. As the more experienced driver, the onus is on you to make that kind of call.
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AK
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Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
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quote:
Originally posted by Ian
quote:
Originally posted by AK
6m30 in - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbg4alKVwUM
could have been messy
What the hell
no idea....
I had started to pass the Clio thinking he was letting me by.... hold up theres a mini on the racing line!
Must have had mech problems... I did speak to him after but cant r'ber the reasons.
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