Bart
Member
Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
User status: Offline
|
im currently still an apprentice with an electrical company, but i also fulfil the role of the I.T manager. currently on 14k a year managing email server, 25 PCs and all hardware/software, tech support within the company internal/external websites (x2).
heres what i have written, if anyone feels they can add to it, please do..
quote:
8 – Are there any issues you wish to bring up at your appraisal?
Yes – Salary is a key issue for me.
I feel my current salary is not the appropriate remuneration for the IT related responsibilities I have and value that I provide for the company. An I.T support manager (who manages and maintains a number of PC’s, network equipment, internal technical support, data management, on/off site backup management etc would be on minimum 25k starting package, this individual alone would not be responsible for other I.T related tasks such as website management and inputs on company literature,
I think I currently fill this role but, this is made more efficient for the company as I also fulfil other roles including; electrical/mechanical drawings, internal/external website design and management, operation & maintenance manuals etc.
I feel my college reports has demonstrated ability and commitment to the company, that commitment will only grow and flourish if I deem my salary reward for my responsibility and commitment is set at an appropriate level.
Over the last year I have completed more and more work outside of office hours, usually favours towards M.B. I am also currently designing a new website out of hours for AICA.
I feel that a salary of 20k is appropriate for my current responsibilities. A salary of anything less than this would not represent my current value to the company. If a lesser salary is all that is offered to me, I would expect the majority of the responsibilities towards the IT to be dropped in order for me to concentrate on electrical drawings.
I have no issues with the work involved in my role, but the salary must be representative of the responsibilities and the cost of alternative IT support either by a dedicated manager or an outside contractor.
I’m unaware of what Eric charges for his IT support but I’m confident it’s 2-3 times my cost to the company.
I have plans to buy a house and get married over the next few years.
I hope to do this in my current job as I enjoy working for this company and I feel I have a lot to offer the company and that over the coming years I will also represent good value to the company. However this will only be possible if I am appropriately rewarded for the responsible role that has developed for me in the company
i was thinking of perhaps printing out sheet from job center of companies looking for a type of I.T support person to compare their wage to mine.
[Edited on 24-11-2005 by Bart]
[Edited on 24-11-2005 by Bart]
|
Ally
Member
Registered: 2nd Jul 03
Location: Pontypool Drives: a Skoda
User status: Offline
|
IMO you shouldnt tell them what you want, tell them you feel you are a valid member of the team and blah blah but dont make demands (you're not exactly demanding more, but could be seen that way)
|
Bart
Member
Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
User status: Offline
|
hmm... ive been told that im almost being taken advantage of, and i should atleast be on 25k, so i have gone for 20k
|
Sam
Moderator
Premium Member
Registered: 24th Dec 99
Location: West Midlands
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Bart
i was thinking of perhaps printing out sheet from job center of companies looking for a type of I.T support person to compare their wage to mine.
You could do, but you have to think about whether they are an OK company to work for who will agree to increase your salary, or whether they will say "if other places pay more then go work for them instead".
They might tell you to GTF to be honest, seeing as you are on £14k and are asking for a £6k salary increase... 
|
Ally
Member
Registered: 2nd Jul 03
Location: Pontypool Drives: a Skoda
User status: Offline
|
But if you find other jobs similar to yours and the salarys are all around the 25k mark, put them all forward. You never know, you may get more
|
Ally
Member
Registered: 2nd Jul 03
Location: Pontypool Drives: a Skoda
User status: Offline
|
i didnt realise you were on 14k 
Bit of a jump Bart, ask for a rise but dont expect too much
|
Bart
Member
Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
User status: Offline
|
14k for everything i do .. surely 20k is the minimum i should be paid.
Absolutly anything I.T related goes through myself, i manage and maintain alot of PCs/Software on a daily basis all in between the job ive been taken on for... trainee electrical designer
|
Sam
Moderator
Premium Member
Registered: 24th Dec 99
Location: West Midlands
User status: Offline
|
Bart I agree your salary sucks big time, but what I'm trying to say is they more than likely might not be prepared to pay you what you are worth, if you see what I mean...
[Edited on 24-11-2005 by Sam]
|
Bart
Member
Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
User status: Offline
|
http://www.sp7.jobcentreplus.gov.uk/Internet/GetDetails.details?jobref=BNS/16789
i fooking do that every day of the week and twice on sundays! 
[Edited on 24-11-2005 by Bart]
|
CCA
Member
Registered: 6th Dec 04
Location: Somewhere Drives: Not a bloody Vauxhall!
User status: Offline
|
It seems highly unlikely that you will get the minimum 6k pay rise that you would like but i wouldnt go demanding that as you could be running the risk of them telling you they will give you a few k pay rise or telling you to stick it
|
willay
Moderator
Organiser: South East, National Events
Premium Member
Registered: 10th Nov 02
Location: Roydon, Essex
User status: Offline
|
they wont see it as you getting paid your worth, what they will be thinking is "WTF, this guy wants a 40%? (or whatever it is) pay rise?"
I think you should just highlight how much IT shit you are doing which is totally out of your job description/roles, tell them you are basically doing someone elses job along the lines of an IT Admin.
Ask them how much they think you are worth to the company, and let them make an offer regarding your pay. THey might pay you more then expected, they might you less 
|
Bart
Member
Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
User status: Offline
|
a couple of months ago one of the mangers was shocked when i told him what i was on, i asked him to guess and he said 20k.
sod them, im gonna go for it
|
Bart
Member
Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by willay
Ask them how much they think you are worth to the company, and let them make an offer regarding your pay. THey might pay you more then expected, they might you less
lmao, i wonder which.
Willay, do you not think my above statement outlines enough of my job role then
[Edited on 24-11-2005 by Bart]
|
willay
Moderator
Organiser: South East, National Events
Premium Member
Registered: 10th Nov 02
Location: Roydon, Essex
User status: Offline
|
key points:
Dont demand
Dont make yourself out to be the latest greatest thing to come to IT (I dont think you are anyway).
Remember, if you fuck them off they can get rid of you and bring in some other guy with experience, knowledge, and possbily for less money (well less then 20k)
|
willay
Moderator
Organiser: South East, National Events
Premium Member
Registered: 10th Nov 02
Location: Roydon, Essex
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by Bart
quote:
Originally posted by willay
Ask them how much they think you are worth to the company, and let them make an offer regarding your pay. THey might pay you more then expected, they might you less
lmao, i wonder which.
Willay, do you not think my above statement outlines enough of my job role then
[Edited on 24-11-2005 by Bart]
Dont know about you but I think the form is far too bloated, you should say you would like to bring up an issue with the current roles you are doing for the company. Possibly not mention pay because this is normally a given on appraisals.
Keep it short and sweet, then talk business when you're in the meeting room 
|
willay
Moderator
Organiser: South East, National Events
Premium Member
Registered: 10th Nov 02
Location: Roydon, Essex
User status: Offline
|
Also regarding pay, if you need to take a stab at it then I would say something along the lines of £18k, also have your role changed to IT Administrator or IT Manager. You dont sound like a apprentice for a leccy's
|
Bart
Member
Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
User status: Offline
|
even tho im the only I.T literate person within the company?
quote:
. If a lesser salary is all that is offered to me, I would expect the majority of the responsibilities towards the IT to be dropped in order for me to concentrate on electrical drawings.
it wouldnt be the worst thing in the world if i had nothing to do wit I.T anymore.
|
Bart
Member
Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
User status: Offline
|
chatting to my future father in law, he pays his secetry (a year or two younger than me) 15k just for answering the phone, she is slightly I.T literate, but they have only just networked their 5 PCs together.
|
willay
Moderator
Organiser: South East, National Events
Premium Member
Registered: 10th Nov 02
Location: Roydon, Essex
User status: Offline
|
different compnies mate, I work in a consultancy for serveral trading outfits, in the city of london, I work my arse off, theres only two of us in this company, I setup alot of shit, my boss is the one who knows alot about routers+switches ( though i learn more and more of that) and I earn under 20k.
I turned 20 in March too.
|
Bart
Member
Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
User status: Offline
|
im 22, the majority of what ive learnt is self taught (and from CS  ). when i first joined the company 3 years ago, i was here 3 months then they sacked the I.T chap here.
He was a project manager and looked after I.T, they sacked him cos of all his fuck ups with jobs (relating to the work not I.T).
All emails/antivirus/backups is all centrally managed by myself. and it does take a % of my day up.
|
Bart
Member
Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
User status: Offline
|
my 'appraiser' is my direct boss, the chap who got me a job to begin with, a close friend out of work. so he will probably tell me to fuck off
trouble is he's very quick on the mark.. where as im not
|
willay
Moderator
Organiser: South East, National Events
Premium Member
Registered: 10th Nov 02
Location: Roydon, Essex
User status: Offline
|
then make a decision, either quit IT or quit whatever you do when you arent doing IT.
|
Ally
Member
Registered: 2nd Jul 03
Location: Pontypool Drives: a Skoda
User status: Offline
|
Or perhaps go to another company where they will pay you more.....
|
Bart
Member
Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
User status: Offline
|
quote:
Originally posted by willay
Remember, if you fuck them off they can get rid of you and bring in some other guy with experience, knowledge, and possbily for less money (well less then 20k)
quite unlikely i'd say.
If this is done they will need to bring in two people, one for the I.T and one for electrical drawings. I would anticipate the two cad designers to be on more than 20k.
CAD design is something the company is struggling to get hold of, its taken them nearly a year to find someone relevant who can just come straight in.
quote:
Originally posted by Ally
Or perhaps go to another company where they will pay you more.....
I dont want to do that. i like the way things are at the moment, having control over the I.T is good, i enjoy the change of senery when a PC goes tits up etc. plus they are a good bunch of people, the only issue i have is the pay.
|
Bart
Member
Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
User status: Offline
|
right, ive passed on everything what ive written to a manager (as a friend to proof read it) and hes made a couple of changes, and also advised me to not mention the sum of 20k, but to also imply aiming for a higher figure. so with that in mind:
quote:
8 – Are there any issues you wish to bring up at your appraisal?
Yes – Salary is a key issue for me.
I feel my current salary is not the appropriate remuneration for the IT related responsibilities I have and value that I provide for the company. An I.T support manager (who manages and maintains a number of PC’s, maintenance and management of network equipment, internal technical support, data management, on/off site backup management etc) would be on minimum 25k starting package, this individual alone would not be responsible for any other I.T related tasks such as website management, producing documentation and inputs on company literature,
I think I currently fill this role but, this is made more efficient for the company as I also fulfil other roles including; electrical/mechanical drawings, internal/external website design and management, operation & maintenance manuals, all media and artwork within the company etc.
I have reviewed jobs online which I feel I am eligible to qualify for given my extensive experience and knowledge. Each of these jobs offer a competitive rate of 25k (average), see attached documents.
I feel that a salary of 24k-25k is an appropriate amount to any individual who has responsibilities and tasks similar to those of myself. A salary anything less than this would not fully represent my current value and input in to the company.
Over the last year I have completed more and more work outside of office hours, usually favours towards M.B. I am also currently designing a new website out of hours for AICA.
I have no issues with the work involved in my role, but I am of a high opinion that the salary must be representative of the responsibilities, and the cost of alternative IT support either by a dedicated manager or an outside contractor, e.g. a competitive rate offered.
I’m unaware of what Eric charges for his IT support but I’m confident it’s 2-3 times my cost to the company.
I have plans to buy a house and get married over the next few years.
I hope to do this in my current job as I enjoy working for this company and I feel I have a lot to offer the company and that over the coming years I will also represent good value to the company. However this will only be possible if I am appropriately rewarded for the responsible role that has gradually developed for me in the company.
|
