Teddy
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Registered: 19th Jul 04
Location: Northampton Drives: VW Bora 1.9TDi pd130
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Right decsion time has come to select the power plant for the Corsa and i have some options which i am considering.
I would agree from the off that the big block's can handle as well as small blocks if time and money are invested.
I know there are small block and big block lovers but i will describe the application for which the car is destined so hopefully an open discussion can take place.
Im not interested in xxxbhp.....Not fussed about power figures really. As long as it can hold its on on the road, pod and track then im happy. Im more interested in torque really (i know this suggests big block but hear me out)
Current options............
Stick with the x16xe - play with it, either forced induction or NA tuning
---Points for - Remain small block and light weight.
---Points agaist - Torque or lack off. Its torque which makes a car go and this is off interest to me added to that money to spend to gain the performance required.
X18XE1 1.8 16v Small block (something which i have already been experimenting with)
---Points for - Tuning goddies available, similar to the x16xe, more displacement, more torque, forced induction again possible (see my turbo concerns later on)
---Points against - Still not overally great torque, money to spend to gain performance.
Good old C20XE
---Points for - Excellent engines, good performance, torque available, tuning opportunities endless.
---Points against - Old engines now, low milers hard to come by, everyone has done it already. If i fitted an 20xe i will have rooed the chance not to fit a LET, obviously big block, weight disadvantage.
C20LET
---Points for - Supercar performance in a light Corsa shell, tuning opportunites to take to make serious power, masses of torque.
---Points against - "Protecting" a turbo agaist long hard abuse (thinking the ring here) concerns me greatly, these engines were never designed to take long hard abuse round a track and i think serious cash could be involved to get it to do this.
The car will be in development for a while (house buying takes preference) i dont want to spend silly amounts on the car, however saying that im not adverse to spending in correct areas to make sure its right. I will continue to lighten the shell as much as possible, from reading this myself i know most will say "fit a 20xe" but to be honest im trying to inspire some kind of lateral thinking as to what im trying to achieve, so please do bear in mind the other options.
Any constuctive input greatly received  (if your steve or not going to offer anything constuctive please dont contibute )
[Edited on 20-12-2006 by Teddy]
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Ant
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Registered: 12th May 02
Location: Hereford and Worcester
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its a tough choice, if money were no object id say an alloy blocked milington 20xe (very light)
It already has the x16xe sat in there so that would save some cash, however to get good power you will have to rev it alot which will take its toll over time if it is to be used hard.
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jr
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Registered: 20th May 02
Location: Kent
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Teddy, to many options, decide exactley what you want to use it for first, to many displins, no engine will suit all of them
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mwg
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Registered: 19th Feb 04
Location: South Lakes
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C20XE
+ point
has the power & torque to start with without having to spend money tuning like with the small blocks
- point
old engine (spend money rebuilding with uprated parts concentrating on making it strong/reliable over making more power)
(uneducated opinion)
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Half Pint
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Registered: 25th Mar 02
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you have to decide on what the car will mainly be used for and how often... the more std the engine the better in the long run.
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Daimo B
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Registered: 20th Mar 00
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I'll throw you out...
What about an XEV? Newer, lighter than a redtop. Not as powerfull, but will happily see 200bhp if you want.
Thing is, you want a track car, that throws a Turbo straight out the window. Turbo + Corsa + Track doesn't work.
Spending out on Turbo'ing the 1.6 will also be a waste of cash again I think, plus the added weight of the manifold, pipework, turbo, will increase the engine weight somewhat.. Might as well have a 20XE...
AS you say, older, but tried and tested.... Good power, reliable engine you know, and can still see near on 200bhp without TB...
For what you want, track and playtime, i'd still have to say the 2.0. Doesn't need to be worked so hard as what a 1.6 will do on track.
BUT
If going for a 2.0, seriously look at ballast for the rear end. Sits very high and skittish and needs some weight to help out, battery, fire ex, cage etc...
Seriously though, consider that ecotec lump, not as good as the redtop, but still a good engine for a corsa. Looks tiny in the engine bay..
Oh, F16 box for the redtop, don't know the equivilant for the newer engines.
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Jambo
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Registered: 8th Sep 01
Location: Maidenhead, Drives: VXR Arctic
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LET (bais) You want torque? you need a turbo.
Endless tuning opertunites, ditch the kkk16 and the crap manifold then you wont encounter the turbo problems.
I see no other option from what you have described.
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Iain M
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Registered: 18th Aug 05
Location: Wigan - Drives 272bhp corsa ZLET
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my personal opinion would be to go for the C20XE.
Yes granted they have already been done by countless people but does this not answer the fact that they are reliable if done right.
To solve the problem of a high milage one, then would it not be possable to rebuild it as you said it will be done over a period of time so there is no rush.
As for ruining the chance of putting a LET in at a later date, i don't think you have as you would already have the foundations to go onto bigger things.
these are my opinions. 
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Teddy
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Registered: 19th Jul 04
Location: Northampton Drives: VW Bora 1.9TDi pd130
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quote:
Originally posted by VXR
What about an XEV? Newer, lighter than a redtop. Not as powerfull, but will happily see 200bhp if you want.
Thing is, you want a track car, that throws a Turbo straight out the window. Turbo + Corsa + Track doesn't work.
Nope dont want an XEv really like you say not as "good" as the good old XE.
Turbo Corsa Track i was thinking NA would be better suited really but plenty of turbocharged cars use the track why cant the let be protected like any other turbo car?
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Teddy
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Registered: 19th Jul 04
Location: Northampton Drives: VW Bora 1.9TDi pd130
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quote:
Originally posted by jr
Teddy, to many options, decide exactley what you want to use it for first, to many displins, no engine will suit all of them
I know what i want to use it for and thats the above.
It will be a bitch of all trades. Mainly track
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Daimo B
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Registered: 20th Mar 00
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Its not as good overall, but its still a good engine, lighter than the redtop. After a proper exhaust, induction system, you should still see 140+ on a RR, which is near what a lot of Redtops are putting out anyway these days 
Seriously, consider it, its lighter, but power to weight.....
How many of those turbo cars are 15 yo shopping trollys with a 200bhp Turbo'd engine runnign FWD... I love FWD, but Turbo FWD on track won't work. The astra does very well, but push past 300bhp and it'll have the TCS light bumming on all the time. The corsa with a LET will just spin up and be quite hard to drive smoothly on a track. Most tubby cars will be RWD or 4x4 so can deliver the power much better.
Seriously, don't go with a turbo if you want proper track fun. Stick with NA... Redtop or Ecotec.
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Teddy
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Registered: 19th Jul 04
Location: Northampton Drives: VW Bora 1.9TDi pd130
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Pah for the sake of an XEV i would stay small block and use that to my advantage.
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Cybermonkey
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Registered: 22nd Sep 02
Location: Sydney, Australia
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Z18XE is a great idea. superb little engine, and has been proven, copes quite happily with 350bhp+ of turbocharged goodness thrown in
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Daimo B
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Registered: 20th Mar 00
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Monkey, how is a 350bhp FWD lightweight corsa going to handle on track??????
Teddy, XEV is far better than the small block still. Im un-sure why your so un-interested in it if your wanting to build a track car? It'll be less work than a 1.8 conversion, has more power, more performance, and practically the same weight and age...
IMO, your options are only a 2.0 NA engine. XEV practically is a small block anyway
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Half Pint
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Registered: 25th Mar 02
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i definately agree with keeping it NA....
i'm building a 1.6 track car as it'll be more fun racing against simular cars such as the
Mitchell / JR motor which is also a 1.6
[Edited on 20-12-2006 by Half Pint]
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Cybermonkey
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Registered: 22nd Sep 02
Location: Sydney, Australia
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quote:
Originally posted by VXR
Monkey, how is a 350bhp FWD lightweight corsa going to handle on track??????
Teddy, XEV is far better than the small block still. Im un-sure why your so un-interested in it if your wanting to build a track car? It'll be less work than a 1.8 conversion, has more power, more performance, and practically the same weight and age...
IMO, your options are only a 2.0 NA engine. XEV practically is a small block anyway
its more fun 
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Stu
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Registered: 3rd May 00
Location: Madchester UK Drives: 2014 BMW M135i
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Id stick with the 1.6 matey! I just think it suits the Corsa better than the heavier 2 litre.
I dont think you need massive power, you need balance. Id go down the throttle body route and look for about 180bhp with an 8k rev limit. If the car is gonna be used as a track weapon I dont think torque will be mega important as you wont be dropping under 6k prm between changes!
Best way to make a car faster is to lose weight. Id def be doing a major amount of this! Stripped completely!
Good luck matey, I think you'll do a good job whatever option you choose, I think youve def got the right ideas!!!
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Daimo B
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Registered: 20th Mar 00
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It will be un-drivable. Teddys requirements are for a track car. I've had the same issue with my car, what to do with it.
Im just keeping my redtop becuase I have it. I wouldn't put a turbo engine in my car if it was for track (FWD anyway).
If i did have a Turbod FWD car for track, it would have to come on the original engine designed in the car.
I just think u'd be dissapointed with a mild spec 1.6 on track over a 2.0 engine. 2.0 won't need to be worked as hard as a tuned 1.6.
[Edited on 20-12-2006 by VXR]
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Teddy
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Registered: 19th Jul 04
Location: Northampton Drives: VW Bora 1.9TDi pd130
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Ill be honest im leaning towards the 1.8 to be honest as i think it will suit what i need it to do.
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Teddy
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Registered: 19th Jul 04
Location: Northampton Drives: VW Bora 1.9TDi pd130
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Plus i have had a nudge in the right direction 
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Craigos
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Registered: 2nd Aug 02
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Depends on your budget.
Either a redtop, striped out as much as possible.
Or a Redtop with tb's Or Even Carbs. My old Corsa was really fun to drive and got treated REALLY bad. dont need a engine management system, you can run no managment on a Cavalier Dizzy. think its the 8v one..
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jr
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Registered: 20th May 02
Location: Kent
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quote:
Originally posted by Half Pint
i definately agree with keeping it NA....
i'm building a 1.6 track car as it'll be more fun racing against simular cars such as the
Mitchell / JR motor which is also a 1.6
[Edited on 20-12-2006 by Half Pint]
Team Mitchy Box Racing
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Jambo
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Registered: 8th Sep 01
Location: Maidenhead, Drives: VXR Arctic
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teddy why not supercharge the 1.8? charger off a mini~??
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Ben D
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Registered: 25th Apr 05
Location: South West
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If your looking at the 20xe would it be that much of a weight jump to the 2.5 v6? 125kw (170BHP) 227Nm (167.4 lb/ft) or even the 3.0 V6 which is 177 bhp. according to wiki, as you said the 2.0 has been done to death this is a bit different, no ?
Ben
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Daimo B
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Registered: 20th Mar 00
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Does anyone actually know what a TRACK CAR actually means????
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