Ben G
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Registered: 12th Jan 07
Location: Essex
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Been watching a few documentaries about people on death row and it's made me wonder if capital punishment is the best way to go about getting justice.
Some inmates were very remorseful. Whether this was them playing upto the cameras, I don't know, but i've always been a supporter of capital punishment.
I think it has a place in modern society, but there has to be no doubt whatsoever that their was intent to murder and it was definitely them.
I watched last night as a young guy admitted killing an off duty police officer. They had been out all day robbing people at gunpoint, then at night this cop and his wife were driving home whilst something hit their windscreen from another vehicle.
The cop followed the pick up until they both stopped and confronted eachother. The cop went to reach for his badge, but the kid thought he had a gun so shot him.
I think if you thought your life was in danger, would you not do the same?
I don't want to sound like i'm supporting this guy, but I just think there is too many variables to give this guy a death sentence.
Obviously theres a lot of different arguments to this so look forward to anyone elses views.
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Ben G
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Registered: 12th Jan 07
Location: Essex
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Sorry for the Paul J essay btw. This subject interests me.
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Marc
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Registered: 11th Aug 02
Location: York
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This is why we have juries and no capitol punishment over here.
In my opinion some criminals deserve to die for their crimes, but if there is any ounce of uncertainty regarding their guilt then the punishment is a huge risk.
The killing of Lee Rigby is a prime example of where capital punishment is appropriate.
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Ian
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Registered: 28th Aug 99
Location: Liverpool
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The thing that gets me about it is the stats. Like that it doesn't actually act as a deterrent in terms of the severity or frequency of crimes.
Plus you have lots and lots of cases where it would have murdered innocent people. By that I mean their involvement was brought in to question. I don't mean remorse. Remorse is fine, you'd feel like that if you'd had years to think about it.
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Dave
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Registered: 26th Feb 01
Location: Lancs
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If we are going to look to another country to improve our justice system America should be a long way down the list.
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GB123
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Registered: 21st Nov 11
Location: Kent
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quote:
Originally posted by Ben G
but there has to be no doubt whatsoever that their was intent to murder and it was definitely them.
That's the problem though, there are so many cases where people were certain it was a particular person and they end up being released years later after new evidence comes to light.
It's a lot harder to release someone who's found innocent after you've killed them.
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Ben G
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Registered: 12th Jan 07
Location: Essex
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Theres more than one country that uses capital punishment.
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John
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Registered: 30th Jun 03
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It's not a deterrent and our justice system is far from accurate enough to be playing with someone's life.
I've watched some of the death row things that have been on recently and some of them are laughable. One of them I thought was a dead cert not guilty, the media reporting on the case thought it was a dead cert not guilty, verdict came back guilty 
Even better than that was the jurors who openly admitted they had no idea what the lawyers were talking about for the most part. How can you give the decision on whether a man is guilty or not, and especially whether to take his life, when they don't have a clue what the evidence means or how to evaluate it.
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Hammer
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Registered: 11th Feb 04
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It's without doubt some deserve it, it's also without doubt that no one or group of people should be capable of deciding that because ultimately humans make fuck ups and unfortunately there's no coming back from this particular one.
[Edited on 18-04-2014 by Hammer]
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ed
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Registered: 10th Sep 03
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There are people who you'd be glad to see dead but I'm against it; for one I think that 'we' should be better than the criminals we're punishing and the other thing is that it's almost an easy way out. You could leave someone to rot away for the rest of their lives or you could just end it for them.
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Brett
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Registered: 16th Dec 02
Location: Manchester
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quote:
Originally posted by John
It's not a deterrent and our justice system is far from accurate enough to be playing with someone's life.
I've watched some of the death row things that have been on recently and some of them are laughable. One of them I thought was a dead cert not guilty, the media reporting on the case thought it was a dead cert not guilty, verdict came back guilty
Even better than that was the jurors who openly admitted they had no idea what the lawyers were talking about for the most part. How can you give the decision on whether a man is guilty or not, and especially whether to take his life, when they don't have a clue what the evidence means or how to evaluate it.
Guy Heinz Jr? If so I thought the same. I wasn't convinces beyond reasonable doubt to sentence him to death anyway.
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John
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Registered: 30th Jun 03
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That's the one Brett.
It also seems a bit stupid to me that they continue to vote until they all agree. If you have doubt at the start, surely that's the way it should stay.
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Brett
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Registered: 16th Dec 02
Location: Manchester
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Yeah, how one was dismissed. Whole thing seemed stupid to me. About the only thing they had was the blood on the underwear. Everything else the defence had come up with was pretty much ignored. I was baffled how one guy could do that to eight people.
Hated how the jurors seemed to be smiling about it too.
[Edited on 18-04-2014 by Brett]
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JordyCarter
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Registered: 14th Mar 10
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Instead of killing them id use criminals of that bracket for pretty much slave labour... just shit jobs they can do inside prison.
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Gary
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Registered: 22nd Nov 06
Location: West Yorkshire
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I'd rather be put to sleep than spend my life in jail so it's a Pointless punishment.
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Tiger
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Registered: 12th Jun 01
Location: Leicestershire Drives:Astra VXR
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If it was absolutely, 100% guaranteed, admitted, caught red handed etc etc, then yes. For example the killer of Lee Rigby. If the case isnt totally clear cut, i'd say no.
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Breathecosse
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Registered: 11th Jun 09
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Bring it back and save tax payers money. The amount wrongly accused is minimal. Sorry if it sounds harsh but I think people that have had first hand experience of family being murdered would agree.
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GB123
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Registered: 21st Nov 11
Location: Kent
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quote:
Originally posted by Breathecosse
The amount wrongly accused is minimal.
That's ok then.
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Bart
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Registered: 19th Aug 02
Location: Midsomer Norton, Bristol Avon
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quote:
Originally posted by Breathecosse
Bring it back and save tax payers money. The amount wrongly accused is minimal.
I suspect if you weigh up a number of compensation claims for families against wrongly executed people, it'll probably balance out what the taxpayers are currently paying.
The thought of this country wrongly executing someone, a man, a father, a husband and ruining a family is enough for me to vote against it.
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ShEp
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Registered: 9th Aug 05
Location: Dingwall, Highland
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quote:
Originally posted by Brett
quote:
Originally posted by John
It's not a deterrent and our justice system is far from accurate enough to be playing with someone's life.
I've watched some of the death row things that have been on recently and some of them are laughable. One of them I thought was a dead cert not guilty, the media reporting on the case thought it was a dead cert not guilty, verdict came back guilty
Even better than that was the jurors who openly admitted they had no idea what the lawyers were talking about for the most part. How can you give the decision on whether a man is guilty or not, and especially whether to take his life, when they don't have a clue what the evidence means or how to evaluate it.
Guy Heinz Jr? If so I thought the same. I wasn't convinces beyond reasonable doubt to sentence him to death anyway.
This.
It wasn't him acting alone.
The police force had a catalogue of errors, and some of the jurors had him down for guilty as soon as he walked in the courtroom
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MoesTavern
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Registered: 19th Jul 07
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quote:
Originally posted by Breathecosse
Bring it back and save tax payers money. The amount wrongly accused is minimal. Sorry if it sounds harsh but I think people that have had first hand experience of family being murdered would agree.
It costs far more to execute someone than to keep them in jail for life.
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Rob_Quads
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Registered: 29th Mar 01
Location: southampton
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How can it cost more to execute some one than to keep them in jail for 25+ years?
[Edited on 18-04-2014 by Rob_Quads]
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FlaFFy_91
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Registered: 30th Sep 08
Location: Formby, Merseyside
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I thought he was guilty from the start ( guy jr case) didn't seem to give a shit through any of the court case. Just sat there with a stupid look on his face. Moved a gun that was " stolen" when it was actually legit. Had his family members blood on his pants... Pants that were underneith his cargo shorts? Yet the shorts had no blood on... People around the caravan where he lived saw no one come in or out apart from him. Told his co worker he was going to kill them all. And smoked $100 worth of crack just before it all...
Guilty
But to the original question. I believe in the death sentence. However as said a few times above. You would have to be 100% sure on the case. And that's hardly ever possible.
Things like the lee rigby case, the guy wanted to be killed by the police. So sentencing him to death would be too good for him
I think if this country was to toughen it's sentencing then we wouldn't need the death penalty
Hear it on the news all the time about murderers or rapists getting life sentences with parole after 15 years or what ever.
I think if you get sentenced to life. You should stay in prison untill you die.
And if you get sentenced 10 years. You should be in prison for 10 years. Not for 3 and get released because you've been a good boy.
[Edited on 18-04-2014 by FlaFFy_91]
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MoesTavern
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Registered: 19th Jul 07
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quote:
Originally posted by Rob_Quads
How can it cost more to execute some one than to keep them in jail for 25+ years?
[Edited on 18-04-2014 by Rob_Quads]
Because anyone given the death penalty is automatically given right of appeal. The appeals process can take years and cost a fortune. In California it costs them something like $300 million for each execution.
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John
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Registered: 30th Jun 03
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quote:
Originally posted by FlaFFy_91
I thought he was guilty from the start ( guy jr case) didn't seem to give a shit through any of the court case. Just sat there with a stupid look on his face. Moved a gun that was " stolen" when it was actually legit. Had his family members blood on his pants... Pants that were underneith his cargo shorts? Yet the shorts had no blood on... People around the caravan where he lived saw no one come in or out apart from him. Told his co worker he was going to kill them all. And smoked $100 worth of crack just before it all...
This comment proves 2 points.
1. Different people interpret the same information in different ways.
2. This is exactly the reason Joe Public shouldn't be called to be on a jury. You've decided he was guilty at the start and completely disregarded the evidence that showed it couldn't have been him, if you hadn't, there is no way that you would conclude 'beyond reasonable doubt'. This shows a general lack of understanding and a lack of being able to follow instructions. I would be very worried if my liberty/life was entrusted to Bob who they've picked up off the street.
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