Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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Hey I was looking at the dbilas flowtec manifold for the Corsa B 1.2 16v Sxi - which as proven by blackula takes the power from 75 to 105 bhp (on a standard corsa - with chip).
I was just wondering how it works exactly? why it gives such a great power increase?
is it because usually on the B - the air has to turn 90 degree's down through the inlet manifold, then another 90 degrees to actually flow into the engine ... where as this the air flows in straight and goes straight in?
Anyone got any drawings / diagrams / pictures of the internals of one of these (or similar?) or can actually explain what features make it so good? i.e. are the branches to each inlet bigger? does the actual main tube section have to be a certain size etc?
Paul J
[Edited on 05-01-2004 by Paul_J]
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Greasemonkey
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Registered: 17th Apr 02
Location: Drives a Tractor
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it is as simple as the air travels a shorter distance so has still got velocity which gives it mass so you cram more air in, easy
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Kris TD
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Registered: 25th Mar 02
Location: Ware, Hertfordshire
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just like cranking up turbo boost sort of.
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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so basically the way it works is a smooth box, which connects straight into the inlets?
thats all? surely there's gotta be more in it than that? how come some give more power than others?
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Greasemonkey
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Registered: 17th Apr 02
Location: Drives a Tractor
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it is a real simple thing, i was so suprised how simple they are its just an empty box nothing cleaver inside
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Greasemonkey
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Registered: 17th Apr 02
Location: Drives a Tractor
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some are better than others cos with some you replace the lower manifold too, some do have slightly smoother internals, but its just slightly different designs, the lexmaul keeps the original inlet route but uses a ram effect the others use velocity they all gain 20ish BHP the Lexmaul only 15
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Greasemonkey
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Registered: 17th Apr 02
Location: Drives a Tractor
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with that dbilas your getting lower manifold as well
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Paul H
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Registered: 11th Aug 03
Location: Lincoln.
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they do these for the corsa c as well don't they?do they give the same sort of bhp as well.just wondering coz i was gonna trade my car for sri corsa but if i can get 100bhp out of it i might as well do that instead
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MikeH
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Registered: 3rd Apr 03
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Actually the way a tuned inlet manifold works is to be the correct length for which the air will resonate at a certain optimum rpm.
When the air resonates you get the maximum amount of air entering the cylinders.
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Fraser Young
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Registered: 26th Dec 02
Location: Dundee City Drives: 58 Impreza WRX
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quote:
Originally posted by chewbaccaman
they do these for the corsa c as well don't they?do they give the same sort of bhp as well.just wondering coz i was gonna trade my car for sri corsa but if i can get 100bhp out of it i might as well do that instead
corsa C, z12xe i/manifold = +23bhp
Bout 800 quid
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Paul H
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Registered: 11th Aug 03
Location: Lincoln.
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cheaper than buying a sri corsa then
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willay
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Organiser: South East, National Events
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Registered: 10th Nov 02
Location: Roydon, Essex
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quote:
Originally posted by chewbaccaman
cheaper than buying a sri corsa then
yep  
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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thats a package too - its including a chip, possibly cams too.
cheers MikeH - I knew there was more to it than just a box.
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Mav 3000
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Registered: 16th Aug 01
Location: Leicestershire
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How much are they? How much to fit?
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Fraser Young
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Registered: 26th Dec 02
Location: Dundee City Drives: 58 Impreza WRX
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quote:
Originally posted by Mav 3000
How much are they? How much to fit?
between 700-1300 quid, DIY job,
usually require Unichipping to give full effect however...
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AK
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Registered: 5th Jul 00
Location: Aberdeen City
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and then you will need to rev the tits off the 1.2 to use that power 
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Mav 3000
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Registered: 16th Aug 01
Location: Leicestershire
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so a 1.6 transplants not only cheaper, but would give better performance across the rev range and roughly the same if not better bhp - right?
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Ant
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Registered: 12th May 02
Location: Hereford and Worcester
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i have a lexmaul inlet on my 1.4 16v You would be amazed at the difference it has made mine has chip, viper induction kit and exhaust manifold. Went from 90 to 110 BHP
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corsa-sxi
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Registered: 11th Jul 03
Location: Kingston upon Hull
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the £800 for the corsa c inlet manifold, does that include fitting and the cams and chips or not?
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Nath
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Registered: 3rd Apr 02
Location: MK
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Do insurance companies sting you when you tell them you have one of these? Would like one for my 14xe with other bits and bobs to get more from it.
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Greasemonkey
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Registered: 17th Apr 02
Location: Drives a Tractor
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there aint more to it than just a box, I HAVE GOT ONE, its an aluminium cast box, thats it, with one hole in one end for the throttle body, and 4 holes in the bottom that go to the lower inlet manifold, thats it apart from 2 vacum pipes, the Lexmaul uses resonation cos its a ram effect inlet the mantzel velso etc i thought just use the simpilest way to get air into an engine, in a straight line and with the greatest velocity there is no time for it to slow down
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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the dbilas flowtec one - I believe comes as a package, so you get the inlet manifold and a dastek chip that they map and run on their rolling road to suit your car.
Mav 3000, your correct, you could probably get a 1.6 16v for about the same cost as the package of chip + inlet manifold ... both leaving it at around 110 bhp with cat back exhaust systems.
The 1.6 16v should probably have more mid range power - but the fact that the 1.2 16v with the inlet + chip would be mapped would possibly mean this would have a smoother torque curve.
Adam K is right - you'd have to rev it hard to get it to shift, but you do already - and providing you don't use cams the power range should be the usual 3, 3.5ish thousand RPM onwards. So wouldn't be too different.
Here's a few reasons why the 1.2 16v with this package may be better than a 1.6 16v transplant 
Ok, number 1) The power is gonna be pretty much the same so no differences there, but because its mapped to your car it may be smoother.
2) If you have low mileage like a lot of 1.2 16v owners do (especially corsa C owners) most will not want to dump their 20,000 mile engine for a 70,000 + mile 1.6 16v unit. This is not only for losing value on the car as a whole, but the 1.6 16v might be a bit fucked - with my Sxi atm, I've raced 3 Gsi's - 1 down santa pod, I beat, 1 down dual carriage way near me I beat and 1 I was just following but was pretty much sat on its ass.
This tells you one thing, either my cars super fast, or all these 1.6 16v's aren't running at their best!!
3) Following on from the value of your car thing, some people who are looking for a new car, may be scared away when buying because its a 'engine conversion', the 1.2 16v could be set back to standard and the inlet / chip combo sold onto someone else - I know I'd definately be interested in a second hand package!!
4) Insurance. Some insurance companies won't like the fact its a engine converted car, even if they do - your premium will now be the 1.6 16v group - however, with the inlet manifold most insurance companies only add 10% to insurance - so you have your existing 1.2 16v group 3 insurance with 10% added (use the corsasport Adrian Flux discount and its no increase). Or you could do what James (essexracer) has done, and ring up your insurance company saying that your inlet manifold was cracked and you replaced it with a cheaper improved one. 
5) It's just the fact that at the end of the day its still a 1.2 - If a 1.6 Gsi beats a VTR - so what? If a 1.2 beats a VTR thats pretty cool.
... I wish dbilas (or regal autosport) would offer me some sort of sponsership (just a cheap package) - as I promote their products enough
Of course this is only if your happy with 110 bhp - if your planning on having a really fast car - your pretty much hitting the limit around 110 bhp for not too much money on the 1.2 16v - If you want anymore, drop a 1.6 16v in and then get a inlet for that etc - or drop a 2.0 in.
But most people with 1.2 16v's bought them as they could not get insured on 1.6's +, most 1.2 16v's I looked at cost a lot more than Gsi's to buy 
Thanks,
Paul J
[Edited on 06-01-2004 by Paul_J]
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Paul_J
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Registered: 6th Jun 02
Location: London
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P.S. anyone on here actually work at regal? they never return my emails (or my email account is messed up)
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Trotty
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Registered: 22nd Feb 01
Location: Bristol
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They didn't reply to my e-mail either dude, sent it aaages ago now 
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broster
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Registered: 6th Dec 02
Location: Drives: E39
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i no what ur saying about tuning a 1.2 paul_j, as i often thought id just tune my 1.4 sport, but iv done that to an extent now and just bored of the power, so im trying to get money together for a 1.6 16v, all the mods on my 1.4 can be swopped over apart from my superchip, but i belive if i get a uni chip on my ecu it may work may be wrong tho! end of the day the 1.2 16v lump is good for what it is, but dont expect too much fro mit, the 1.6 leaves you with loads more options ok the insurance is more but itll be worth it!
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